Advice needed please

[Margaret J]

sorry John i did state in the first post that it was another group of walkers

but i should have made this clear in the further post ....

.... and i have no intention of being anything other than civil... as pointed out in previous post i am not interested in tit for tat arguments..

[Alan and Lynsey]

no physical damage does not = no psychological damage.

i guess we will have to agree to disagree then.

i would also like to point out that i hold no ill feeling toward Margret or any of her dogs.

Alan

again remember we are here to help Lucy on this particular post, so let get back on topic.

PS, sorry for bringing this up on the forum but i thought it was relative. sorry for it being so heated john.

[Margaret J]

i do not feel it has been heated Alan .. i bear no hard feeling for you bringing it up !!!! i just think sometimes it is better to give the bigger picture .. thats all..

as for Margaret's post i did say i could not comment on her psychological damage other than to say on meeting her prior to this she did not come across as a confident dog ..

i was however, angry at the lack of facts in Margaret post .... funny how things get under our skin...

....especially when it is good friends involved ... hey i guess that's what makes us all human and individual ... .. life would be boring if we all agreed just for a quiet life... sorry not me...

[Margaret]

Sorry I've just seen these posts and feel I need to clarify some points. Margaret I don't think I said or implied Lucy was attacked, I believe I said she was chased by 2 GSDs which is what happened. This was our third walk with this group, and on our first walk I asked the organisor to let me know when she could go off lead which she duly did within the first 5 minutes of the first walk. The only conversation I had with you Margaret was halfway through this walk when we were talking about the training school, how long you had been attending etc. At no time did you suggest that Lucy should be put back on the lead, and as the organisor was with us at the time, I feel sure she would have said something about this if you had, so I'm sorry but I think you're mixing me up with someone else.
Another point is that yes I had eventually gone home but as I am on my own and despite my strong feelings for Lucy it did not seem prudent for me to be wandering around Palacerigg in the pitch dark on my own. Perhaps you would do this Margaret, I don't know. I had plans to return at first light, however when I was notified that she had possibly been sighted (by Chris who had gone out for a takeaway and decided to have another quick look for her before going home) I had no thoughts of my own safety and went right back, and had some confidence that two people were waiting back in their cars for me while I walked through the park for a while on my own looking for her. Yes, I was terrified while doing this but didn't like to ask these people who I hardly knew to accompany me. It took an hour and a half to get close enough for her to recognise me, and no, she was definitely not having fun she was desperately trying to find my scent and I believe did not even see us at first as the car headlights were shining on her. There are a few other errors in your account which I won't bore everyone with, but as you said Margaret, you weren't there.
I didn't go into all the details of who I was walking with or who did what as it was not relevant to the post - I was genuinely seeking help for my pup who was having difficulties as a direct effect of the incident, however it was caused. I have no bad feelings towards the dogs or their handler and was very grateful for their assistance in getting Lucy back, as you would have seen from my post on that website. Hope this clarifies things.

[Alan and Lynsey]

Hi Margaret,

how is Lucy getting on?

cheers,
Alan

[Margaret]

Hi Alan,
Thanks for asking. To be honest I could do without all this hassle as the whole incident has been very upsetting. However Lucy has improved in most areas though is being very attention seeking and is also now quite aggressive to Freddy. I know I need to get back to a strict pack order (and I'm sure I will in time) but I'm not quite up to it yet. At least we're getting out everyday and she's doing much better with other dogs.
Thanks to everyone for their support.
Margaret.

[Heather]

Hello, im Heather. i am the owner of the 2 GSD's involved in the incident. i am not posting on this thread to start an argument, however as i was involved and have been brought into it i feel i should be able to put my version of events across. Margaret i am aware you have merely posted to get advice regarding Lucy and I have offered my advice also, however i am a little miffed at how things have been portrayed regarding you searching for her "alone and terrified" and also Lucy's behaviour when we spotted her that night.

My dogs did run after Lucy and she was lost for approximately 6.5 hours, this was very upsetting for all involved. however id like to point out that we did all we could to find her. We searched for her until dark, margaret, you left before us - chris was still out looking for her when you left, so you were not left alone to look in the dark. Chris and I then drove home, via Abronhill to look for her. As chris had been working overtime and had came straight to palacerigg from work to search, he decided to go for some food, however changed his mind on route and went to palacerigg instead - this was not to have a "quick look before going home" as you stated.

I also think its a little unfair to imply that chris and I simply sat in our cars in the carpark while you walked about palacerigg on your own. prior to you arriving we had both walked around the area she was seen (near the carpark, but not in it) i also drove around the park, nearly getting stuck. when you arrived we both stated that she had been seen in the same area - it was your decision to walk further into the park. we both placed our cars so that the headlights were shining on the area she was seen in - we also stayed in the cars as we didnt want lucy to get scared, i imagine we would be covered in the scent of the dogs that had frightened her. you weren't walking about alone for long and sat in my car with me until she was spotted again, approximately 5 more times.

with regards to Lucy not recognising you, i also dont see how that is possible - she walked right past you on numerous occassions - nose to the floor sniffing and tracking into the bushes - where the animals are! she also looked at you when you called her and then trotted off - hardly the actions of a terrified dog. you commented on his to me stating " we should call it a night, she isn't interested in coming to me, i'll come back up when its light and we can see where she goes", this would indicate that you thought she was tracking animals, not that she couldn't recognise you. there is also no way she couldnt hear you calling her - she was more likely 'running deaf' as she was in tracking mode - she is a terrier after all.

but anyway, i just wanted to clarify some points - i feel slightly agrieved as, yes it was my fault regarding Lucy going missing, however we searched for 6 hours of the 6.5 hours she was away and if it had not been for chris, Lucy would have been out all night.

I had really hoped that this incident wouldn't have put you off walking with us, and i dont want to get into a petty argument about it. I was extremely sorry about what happened and still feel awful about it.

With regards to any mental scars - i cannot comment on this as i only met her that night, although i am no expert, she looked like she was tracking prey to me, not "snifffing for your scent like her life depended on it". however if you are correct that she is now displaying adverse behaviour I would advise that you get back into group walking and meeting other dogs right away. She is a young dog and i am sure with some careful socialisation she will be fine.


Heather

[TC]

Hi Heather,
You and Chris went beyond the call of duty to help. Lucky it was a group dog walk (which turned into a dog hunt) where everyone did their best to help to find Lucy. It could have been a lot worse if Margaret had been walking alone and had encountered strangers walking strange dogs off lead.

Also common sense should be used if allowing your puppies off lead and you're unsure or know your dog does not have good recall without consequence. At the end of the day, it's for the owner to decide.
A number of walkers in the group already keep theirs on lead.

You're spot on too Heather, socialisation is so important.

Colin.

[Margaret]

Heather I certainly did not mean or imply any criticism of yourself or Chris - I was very grateful for your assistance and said so. When I said I was scared of the dark this is true, and it seemed a long time to me when I was out on my own and you and Chris were in the cars. I also was not aware that you had been searching for so long - I thought everyone was leaving the park at the same time. So again, my heartfelt thanks for that. I must have misunderstood whoever said about Chris popping back for one more look, I can't even remember who said it now.
When I caught my first glimpse of Lucy she looked terrified to me with her ears straight back and tail tucked etc. This is a wee dog who never leaves my side. Later when she crossed the path a few times and didn't seem to be paying heed I did think at that time that she was playing games, but by the time she by chance came walking towards the cars, I saw her stop and her whole demeanour changed. That's when she finally recogised me and ran towards me. As I said before, I don't think she saw me previously as she would have been dazzled by the headlights.
I hope we can now draw this to a close.