So upset... Rufus went for another dog.

[Susan]

Please can you guys give me some advice, I just don't know what to do. I take Rufus to the club training too, and tonight he went for another dog, I am just so shocked and upset. The dog is a young collie type and it only started last week and Rufus didn't seem to like it, they were staring each other out and growled at each other, the first time he has ever did that. This week they seemed ok and were next to each other in the sit stays, when rufus wandered over to it and suddenly they were fighting and rufus was the aggressor he had hold of the other dogs neck and it took what felt like ages before I managed to pull him off. I can't believe it happened, he has never before shown any sign of aggression. I feel like I can never let him off lead again in case he goes for a dog, and one that fights back this time. You guys know him, he is usually a sweetie. Is it possible this is a one off. Or is this his adult personality? Will neutering help?
Susan x

[John Thomson]

Firstly Susan.....take a deep breath and slow down.........

What seemed to last a lifetime in reality was probably only a few seconds.........

dog fights always sound and look bad...the reality is that often they are all noise and flashing teeth with little or no actual contact.
If he so much as looks at this dog next week give him a correction he will not ignore /forget. One good correction is worth a thousand half hearted nagging corrections.

Can you recall the chain of events? How old is the collie? Male or female. Who was taking the class? Their response?

The more info you can give the better..........details are important.

It may be that he needs out and socialised on walks.
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John Thomson
www.cumbernaulddogtraining.co.uk

[kendal]

i wouldn't panic just yet, you cant expect him to get on with every dog. you said he/she was new, Rufus may just have felt he needed to assert his dominance like most of the dogs do on the walks.

my two are constantly at each others throats but it is all noise and there has never been any damage
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microchiping and grooming www.chipnclip.co.uk

[Susan]

Hi John,

Thank you so much for replying, I know it probably seems like I am making a huge fuss, I am just so shocked, I am sitting with the tears running down my face. I have tried so hard with him to make sure he is well socialised, and he has never been anything but wanting to play with another dog, he has never snapped or growled at anyone. But I have noticed that he is getting much bolder - on Sunday he was up on Diesel and trying to wrestle him.

The collie is a male, he is called Oscar. I'm not sure how old he is, but I think quite young. He is a bigger dog than Rufus, by a long shot, but Rufus was, without a shadow of a doubt, the aggressive one. There was contact, because that was what was stopping me getting Rufus off, he had his paws on this dogs shoulders and his mouth on his neck and shaking his neck. He didn't break the skin though.

I think they both kind of snapped at each other initially but Rufus was the worst, he was the one jumping on the other dog.

I got him off, and I can't even remember the rest of the class, I think I was just on autopilot. I know I didn't correct him properly, I just wheeked him away as fast as I could. The woman running the class is called Maureen, I spoke to her at the end, and she said that Rufus really did have a hold of the other dog, but she said this is the age when they can try this kind of thing, and that I have to be the boss of him. She said he is usually fine, and not to worry, and to still come back to the class, but I hadn't even thought of not coming back to the class until she said that and I realised it must have been bad enough for her to think I would think that! But now I don't know, Oscar will be there, and I cannot trust Rufus not to go for him.

I need to get him out on the walks again, he has not had proper play with other dogs for ages. I am going to start from tomorrow, wherever you guys are going in the evening. Part of me thinks this was just, for some reason, a dog that he clashed with, as he spoke to Mandy and to the golden cocker boys at the end, and was his usual self with them. I just feel that what he did, he only got away with it because he is small, if he was a big dog he could really have hurt the other one. I feel so confused. I was going off the idea of having him castrated, and now I want to send him this week!

[Susan]

Thanks Kendal..maybe that is just what it is, he won't like every single dog he meets.

I remembered some more, it was all horrible, because it was a wee girl handling Oscar, and she was screaming and crying, and so they were calming her down, and I was just getting Rufus away and saying how sorry I was, and Maureen the trainer said, its OK, its Ok, don't worry.

I have not spoken to him all night, and have told him to go away whenever he has tried to cuddle up to me, but then I feel that he doesn't understand why he is being punished now. I just want to cuddle him, but don't think I can, as then he thinks all is ok.

[John Thomson]

Susan..you need to slow down and put this into perspective........some dogs dislike another particular dog ( usually this is male/male or female/female).
he would perhaps push his luck with Diesel.......because Diesel would allow it......Murphy would simply have hammered him and put him firmly in his place

Now you have a head start........you know he may react to Oscar. Your job now must be to react quickly and decisively if he makes any move towards him.....timing is the key to this..you know it will happen again the only question is when......and when it happens you want to catch him with a correction that every time he thinks about going for Oscar again....his sensible head says...nah, it's simply not worth it.

go back to basic pack order and let him know his place......getting onto sofas and beds is all very well ( and more likely with as small adorable dog)........but confuses a dog and give them ideas above their station in life............if you are not consistent with pack order the dog will challenge.......his hormones are starting to kick in now.........he does not know his own size.

Maureen will have said that not because she thought that Rufus's behavior was bad but because they need to keep as many members as they can.
_________________
John Thomson
www.cumbernaulddogtraining.co.uk

[Barry]

Susan, i know it easier said than done, but try not to worry. Not all dogs will get on, no matter how well they are socialized! As john mentioned good correction (at the time) is crucial! Chances are now, Rufus does not kno what you are mad at him for?
Its like your dog running away from you, you calling him in recall, him coming straight back, then you giving him a bollocking for going away in first place. Dog is then left with feeling you gave him into trouble for returning? I know it is easier said than done and you must be confused.... John and the rest of the experienced gang will keep you right. I,m sure everyone encounters something similar at some point, some more extreme than others!? The walks are great for the dogs, i know Tikka gets alot from them, and so do i with talking to the owners and experience in hoe dogs PLAY! Some play harder than others.... bu this is perfectly normal, and is supervised well by team effort!
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Barry, Kylie & Jay with precious Rotti Tikka

[Janis]

chill susan !!!!!


rufus is fine and as john has stated just get back to pack order and calm yourself or he will pick up on the tension and react on it!

you are the pack leader so therefore you are the calm one and when something kicks of you quickly correct the situation in a calm and controlled manner! rufus will then take lead from you that he was out of order you are the boss and feel the presence of your calm and you are in charge!

as kendal says our two always have a go at each other and that's their way of playing but it sounds ferocious and can be frightening to those who don't know them!

on sunday my gypsy had an under the breath snarl when rufus came over to her, she quickly got told off by me that it was not acceptable ! she can be a wee minx if she thinks i am going to fuss over other doggies! i just don't let her dictate to what she thinks i can and cannot do! i'm the boss! and that goes for the kids too!...............just ask kendal!!!!

look forward to seeing you and rufus on future walks!




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Cockapoo's...a little of this, a little of that..........
the perfect combination!

[JennyMc]

Susan try not to worry Bear'll be back soon, when my other dog is finished season and he's not raging hormone! So everyone will forget Rufus and be worrying that Bear will try to violate their dogs to be concerned about Rufus As the owner of a nutty dog (Tala) the advice you have got is good so just stay calm and put it into practice and keep your chin up

[marcella]

lots of good advice here Susan, I hope this morning you're feeling a wee bit better and calmer.

[Susan]

Thank you all so much!
I am a lot calmer today, but I am still kind of in shock. I really believed that he didn't have an aggressive bone in his body, and my only worry was that he would be the one who was turned on by another dog.

I will work on strict pack order. He does get up on the furniture, but I never thought it was causing problems, and in the morning he gets up onto the bed for cuddles.

He is actually not speaking to me this morning, and wouldn't even look me in the eye, so he clearly feels that he is in the bad books.

I really, really do believe that he is not a bad dog, and this was just a complete personality clash, but it was just such a shock to realise he was actually biting the other dogs neck. I know he might have a wee snarl at a dog sometimes, but this just seemed so bad!

THank you guys so much for the support, I can't tell you how much help you have been
xxx

[Suzanne H]

Otto had a rumble at me a couple of times pre-snip when I tried to move him - a sharp correction seems to have sorted it out. He was just pushing his luck.

It is weird seeing new, bad, behaviour in a young dog, just needs to know it's not acceptable behaviour in no uncertain terms.

[kirsty]

its already been said nothing much I can add accept my sympathies, having a dog myself that has a go on a regular basis. Its horrid, but when you put it into perspective, its is how dogs behave and we get more upset about it than the dogs. Pack order, Pack order Pack order!

[kendal]

[Ashley]

Oh Susan, it was actually distressing reading your panicked posts..
I'm glad you've calmed down a bit. Rufus is a wee sweetie, and everyones right, its probably just hormones, a clash and pack order issues!